Trails or Spillover possible?

[JEL]

I have my MOD Duo hooked up to my Kemper in an effects loop. I’m using my MOD Duo as an ambient pedal and lead boost, but the only way to mute everything is to simply turn off my effects loop on the Kemper or to use a relatively empty bank. The only problem is that when I kill the effects loop to my Mod Duo, or if I change banks to a bare bank, I lose all of my effect trails and there is no spillover effect.

Is there a way to allow effects to spillover when changing from one to the other? Ideally, it would be great if I could just leave my Mod Duo on all the time and then just bypass the effects with trails so that a spillover is maintained. Is this already possible in the Mod Duo?

[dan_remaincalm]

one workaround might be -

• leave your reverb etc plugins on, not bound to the pedal button
• signal chain: input -> switchbox2 -> [1 goes to output] [2 goes to reverb], then reverb -> output
• use the toggle control to switch the switchbox

i.e.

                          _______
                         /       \
in -> switchbox                    --------- output
                        \ reverb _/

[dan_remaincalm]

by the same token, you can do all sorts of clever tricks with the dual input and an A/B switch box on both input or output

e.g. you can have up to four totally different chains - 1 -> 1, 1->2, 2->1, 2 -> 2 (that just split at the input and sum up at the respective outputs) - you can only toggle two fx using the mod footswitches but you can still do a bunch of cool stuff because the routing is so flexible

[solobasssteve]

I do this a lot by having the reverb 100% wet in a parallel path and assigning a CC pedal in front of it. At the moment to make that work, you need 2 gain controls, one set to - 40db, the other assigned to the CC pedal, as there’s no way to set a maximum value to cc control inside the MOD Duo. But this is an easy work around and means I can have variable levels of reverb/delay with the tails left intact.

[JEL]

I figured out a way to get trails/spillover! I used the new ToggleSwitch4 (utility) and assigned 2 sets of effects to the toggleswitch that I can easily bypass. I ran a stereo signal through the other 2 toggleswitch channels that are always on so that there was a constant dry signal going through. Then, I just assigned the footswitches to bypass each of the 2 effects.

So for example, footswitch 1 turns my ambient sound on and off and then footswitch 2 turns my tube screamer on and off. So, it’s an amazing setup I’ve got now - all because of the 4 way toggleswitch! And, I added the toggleswitch to the beginning of the signal chain so that my ambient tails/trails wouldn’t be cut off when I bypass the ambient sound! It’s amazing!

[JEL]

Here’s my pedalboard - sorry it took so long to get it recorded and shared:

Swell Boost - MOD Devices

[redcloud]

Thanks for the effort @JEL
Unfortunately this is just a trick because if I want trails on the amp line of the chain (red rectangle) it is simply not possible at the moment (unless you use an external reverb). Nowadays this is a must have for most of guitar players who wants an all-in-one device.

EDIT: It seems that spillover should be managed by each plugin. falkTX is trying to work on a POC to test the functionality outcome.

[redcloud]

I think spillover should be managed by each plugin which has a time based effect.

Moving from path A to path B will keep the spillover but if you remain on path A and simply turn off the reverb, the spillover will be truncated. This could be an expected behavior if you don’t use snapshots but suppose we want to use two snapshots for the following pedalboard

with snapshot1 that has reverb ON and snapshot2 that has reverb OFF. In this case, if we switch from snapshot1 to snapshot2 we’ll get spillover truncated because reverb does not “include” the behavior of the A/B switch plugin used in the first image.

So possible behaviors are two: 1) if I turn OFF the reverb directly by pressing the OFF button, it’s just fine that spillover will be truncated since is an expected behavior but 2) if I turn OFF the reverb because another snapshot is selected then the reverb should not truncate the trails.

Obviously the workaround would be to use an A/B switch before each time based effect and use it to turn off the effect but the pedalboard could become messy in a blink of an eye…

The ideal solution would be to add a “soft turn off” switch to each time based plugin which will let the trails end gracefully. This new switch would be used by default on snapshot change (but should be customizable I suppose: use hard turn off or soft turn off on snapshot change).

[jon]

Although I would say that this makes a lot of sense (and I’m mapping it on the requests) in the end it’s more of a plugin developer decision than on our side of things.

[unbracketed]

What about developing a plugin that would wrap (decorate in programmer parlance) other plugins for the purpose of controlling the reverb tail? The “TailRunner” plugin settings would let you select your target plugin and then have a few settings for handling the decay. The TailRunner would be aware of snapshot changes and possibly have an A/B switch that would also handle the reverb tails when the audio path changes.

It would be encouraging for MOD to have some plan around this in the long term other than relying on third party developers to do a bunch of special-case platform work.

[falkTX]

For plugins-within-plugins I have this little thing: https://github.com/DISTRHO/Ildaeil
But it is always stereo and doesnt do MOD specific features

[redcloud]

I think should be easier to manage this behavior at platform level, not at single plugin level. Something like “add an hidden on/off switch plugin right before each time-based plugin” and “if the on/off switch is pressed on the time-based plugin, redirect the event to the preceding on/off switch plugin”.

But I suspect it would be even easier if it is possible to intercept and override the turn off event behavior of a single plugin in order to only “close the input port” letting the output buffer being consumed. Just speculating.

[unbracketed]

@redcloud

I think should be easier to manage this behavior at platform level

Agreed, that would be a much better experience for the user. While it’s easy to conceptualize, it’s probably a fair amount of technical work to realize properly. That’s probably why Headrush advertises it prominently on their packaging - they put in the work to make a seamless system. On their system you can enable/disable tails per pedalboard.

For guitarists playing modern rock / pop / EDM it’s not unusual to have parts in a song that alternate between shimmery chords, jangly arpeggios, and crunchy riffs. On my Duo many of my pedalboards generated warble / crackle when changing snapshots or switchboxes when modulated effects are involved. Imagine - you’re in the bliss of Shiro-powered shimmer undulating through stereo speakers, overtones darting around in an elegant dance, and you hit a switch intending to add a crunchy little fill underneath, and … hard cut on the shimmer. I can live with that in the garage while practicing, but it’s not usable for performing.

To be honest, even though I wasn’t aware of the concept of reverb tails until a few years ago, I’d be hesitant to purchase an effects unit without it now.

[redcloud]

Just found that SHIRO Gaffa Delay has a Trails switch that does exactly what’s needed here. Other plugins should do the same.

[spunktsch]

I use a little workaround for pedals without tails.

I put my fx chain through a Stereo X-Fade and connect the A/B knob to a bunch of slew rate limiters that are controlled by a cv control.
The only downside is it doesn’t start righ away when activated and you have the gain bump when channels overlap. Other than that it works great.

[jon]

Looks cool! Could you also share the pedalboard in the feed?

[spunktsch]

shure. I’ll just have to finish the controls and the touchinterface.

[jon]

deal